Politics – Senator Evan Bayh of Indiana, who backs Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton for president, proposed another gauge Sunday by which superdelegates might judge whether to support Mrs. Clinton or Senator Barack Obama.
Democrats may not like the outcome, but liberals can't lose this one. McCain is a liberal. Heads you win, tails we lose. Actally, the GOP lost when McCain won, so the GOP is already down for the count.
It's a tragic set of events for the Democrats. In an election they should be able to take for granted, the struggle between Obama and Hillary could well place McCain in the White House.
Well, I never thought in a million years I'd vote for Hillary. But McCain and Obama wouldn't have it any other way. I will be damned if the beltway GOP is going to shove McCain down my throat, and there's no way I'm voting for a tribalistic race warrior.
If McCain is a liberal then why is there no way in h-ll I would vote for the man? Realize this man already acquiesced on the tax cuts (now somehow they are a good thing). This kind of talk has got to stop. He is a neocon trying to hide in sheeps clothing. Any Democrat that votes for this man is likely voting against their own economic interests as well as the interests of America. Unless you are investing heavily in the M.I.C. or are somehow benefitting from Beijing holding so much of our debt this is a very bad call. McCain should not even be a considered choice. I cannot believe we are seriously considering a third administration based on neoconservative principles. Haven't the American people learned by now? Apparently not. Like Nero fiddling as Rome burned...
Many liberals have likewise spurned Hillary, mostly over the Iraq vote. That vote also keeps McCain from getting liberals on board. Put that vote aside, and McCain is Hillary without the mascara.
I do have a friend who makes a single compelling argument for voting McCain: In the SCOTUS nomination tug-of-war, McCain singlehandedly put together a bipartisan nucleus that broke the stalemate. Dem or Rep, that is the kind of effectiveness that is needed at times on the Hill.
I'm glad there's another person out there Georgia who sees the differance between liberal/conservative and dem./repub.It took me a while to gaet past the terms.
But McCain shares many(not all)of the views of the dem. candidates on key issues.
rdy2rck,
Please tell us which views does McCain and the Democratic candidates agree on?
If this dumb thing posts. Two right off the top of my head are immigration and the war in Iraq plus McCains voting record is there for all to see. Of course we'll see what Mccain has to say in the generals.
You might want to re-check McCain's position on Iraq. He is on the neocon side. No Democratic candidate holds those views (at least not openly). His only objection to the neocon line is the torture issue and that's personal.
And somebody better do SOMETHING about immigration instead of saying every idea sucks. As it stands the only workable option to resolve the problem is to turn America into a police state where your papers are demanded at every turn then deport those who cannot produce legitimate documents. But then we would not be America. And we would also see massive labor shortages in specific industries (You want to pick lettuce?). We must get moving forward on this issue.
I respect your opinions VOR. I just wish I could discuss in real time.Immigration is a toughie but they all agree on some form of amnesty bill.I agree with the occams razor this issue brings on.
As for Iraq,they all agree it was a mistake, there's just details on withdrawing. But McCains record is there. He was for torture(IMO)and wiretapping which s---s.
But in general his record shows what is loosely termed "liberal."
rdy2rck,
It's a travesty that ideals and humanity in America are shunned by many as "being too liberal" and using the word "liberal" as a pejorative.
To this point, there are no "conservatives" that can or will define what "conservative" means, yet they readily deride others opinion as Liberal, another word they can't define.
That's why I said loosely. Most people use the terms liberal and conservative as party affiliation. But people deriding others cuts both ways and that is obvious.People just as readily define ideas as too "conservative."
I have recently have had others convince me that I'm a "progressive liberal thinker" but am not a democrat or republican.Based on the dictionary definition of conservative many,many on both sides are such, part of which mean close mindedness.
The ninnies who call McCain a liberal are the same ninnies who were coerced into voting for Obama in a cross-over primary..
Not only that but their Fuhrer (Rush Limbaugh) or is he their
Minister of Propaganda, also call McCain a liberal....
There are quite a few of them here who are now calling Bush a liberal once they could no longer defend his Karl Rove, Dick Cheney, and Donald Rumsfeld agenda.
When they get confused they just shout "liberal" three times and think their confusion will go away!!
This is what we're dealing with.
Damn education, learning from your mistakes and honest debate, "full steam backwards"!!
Correction, it was a vote for Hillary that Rush suggested. This was especially in Texas and Ohio (also well evidenced in Mississippi) where he hoped to bring the process to a boil. He did succeed in skewing the delegate numbers somewhat as for instance 25% of Hillary's vote in Mississippi came from Repubs. Also affected the vote in the other two critical states. A fairly underhanded and un-American thing to do but this is luvable Little El Rushbo. His listeners don't just excuse his vile tactics they join in.
Wonder if Rush will have anything positive to say about McCain before the convention? If past history is any indication he should be slobbering over him by October. It's either that or the daily 10 minute hate will simply extend to three hours daily and occupy the whole show. I Hate Hillary! I Hate Obama! I Hate McCain! That kind of talk has always gotten his best ratings. But in the end he will steer his flock to McCain.
Who know exactly WHAT McCain is? You'd have to ask him TODAY to define his positions. And, by tomorrow he may be completely different. I recommend: don't vote FOR any of these. If necessary write in Ron Paul (or Mickey Mouse for that matter) that way you will never be humiliated by having to admit you voted FOR someone who did horrible things such as any of these three almost certainly will.
georgia.
I thought your state had learned before the states even deeper in the south that racist comments and thoughts are nothing to be proud of and very un-American.
many do it so naturally they don't even realize what they are saying and how it sounds to others..
Tribalistic????
Race warrior???
What do those comments make you??
Go Hillary!!!!!!!! Your the Woman to help get America back on it's feet. Hang in there.
DandT,
You know you have my respect. And I respect your opinion and your right to support Hillary Clinton over Barack Obama. But I sincerely hope that if Obama does secure the Democratic nomination that you will vote for him.
As you recall, I was supporting John Edwards from the beginning of this campaign.
However, I want the Democrats to WIN this election and, with all due respect, I do not believe Hillary Clinton can deliver a win ...especially since the ONLY way she can secure the nomination is if the superdelegates usurp the popular vote (which favors Obama). IMO, this will destroy the Democratic Party and hand the Republicans a victory. We cannot afford that!
And that is to say nothing of the war or the justices appointed to the U.S. Supreme Court in the next president's term(s).
Please don't vote for McCain by default should Hillary lose the nomination.
...and conversely, I promise that I will reluctantly vote for Hillary should Obama lose the nomination.
Scott
I hope you will NOT trade your vote for anybody's respect. It is your right to choose as you wish! The only respect you want and need is that of your own self!!!!
There are MANY who would vote for McCain in the fall and contrary to what obacarama people want you to believe, he will NOT win against McCain.
Truth is, the republicans would prefer to run against him and it is enough to take a serious, comprehensive look at the contest to see it. Plus, all the hype and empty rethoric (which is all obama has to offer anyway)is MUCH tarnished by his association and lack of judgment regarding the 'pastor-disaster' issue.
Hillary is the best choice, unless McCain does a 180 on the Iraq war. As someone who abstained from voting in 2004 but before that always voted Republican I have become an admirer of Clinton.
Obama has the support of 99% of the unbridled fanatics, 95% of the Muslims & 90% of the blacks that's a losing coalition.
I am none of the above and he has the support of many Americans who believe in the American dream and do not see race or color as another reason to do the wrong things.
Your comments are wrong and unfounded.
I'm amazed at the amount of utopian seeking voters falling for his syrupy dialogue. If you get your wish which I doubt, I'm certain he'll lead the gullible down a path that they never expected or intended.
You have lost your concept of what a leader is..
I feel sad for you. you look for one-liners and quick feel good lies to satisfy your very limited interests and commitment..
You're a hit an run poster here, so obviously politics is just a hobby for you.
There have not been any great speakers since Reagan and
JFK and now that we finally have one you want to assassinate his character before he is even given our country a chance to be inspired by his charisma..
Again, I feel sad that someone can be satisfied for for so little and have such simple expectations...
With a thought process like yours America would have been
stripped of many other great leaders, and I'm not sure if your motivation is based on fear or ignorance, but either
is sad... real sad!
You wanting more of the same..that is what you are saying.
That is sad.
Clinton Backer Points to Electoral College Votes as New Measure
219 years using electoral voting to elect a president and her backers are just NOW realize this?
I little slow on the up take eh?
No she wants to use the "Electoral College" because it's the only way she can win. Clinton's only want what's best for the Clinton's. When will people learn.
FTA: At the time, Mrs. Clinton, who had just been elected to the Senate, said, "I believe strongly that in a democracy, we should respect the will of the people and to me, that means it's time to do away with the Electoral College and move to the popular election of our president."
If history and statistics mean anything, the Clinton years were the best in recent memory for A LOT OF PEOPLE... at least the policies were aimed at the American people, not the African continent...
If we are to pay higher taxes, I want something in return for me, here!, not charitable contributions to whomever obacarama considers important (and based on his associations and expressed intentions it is NOT here first).
The Party of Change. This campiagn from the dumbocrats has been this biggest joke for a primary I have ever seen A party that preeches change has been dirtier than any major election and its not done yet. Race, gender relgion, what ever card can be played it has been by this party. The demcrats do not even seem to care about any of the facts. That Hillary is going to court in the summer. Obama connections to corrupt leaders. That they are not even running a complete election because they are ignoring two states, that popular vote wont matter as proven in this article.
Everything them dems say they are against doesn't matter as long as their canidate gets elected. They are hypocrits and even worse as the republicans.
ALBMORE;
"A party that preeches change has been dirtier than any major election"
Apparently, you have a very short memory--a common problem for neocons such as yourself. In truth, the Republican primary between Bush and McCain was MUCH nastier.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opin...
"What followed was a primary campaign that would make history for its negativity. Anonymous opponents used 'push polling' to suggest that McCain's Bangladeshi born daughter was his own, illegitimate black child. In the conservative, race-conscious South, that's not a minor charge."
"Bob Jones University professor Richard Hand sent an e-mail to stating that McCain had 'chosen to sire children without marriage.'"
Obama and Clinton have tried to refrain from making personal attacks. Those who are engaging in them are usually vocal proponents who are acting individually and without the candidate's consent.
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There are more primaries can't we wait to see what happens and then move to the next step. I a sick of the infighting.
Why did Propeller pin this story with the phrase "The Old College Try"? I get the play on words regarding the Electoral College, but seems like it puts a negative opinion on Mr. Bayh's idea.
Was that intentional?
It is a play on words and even more importantly an emphasis on "try"..Quite honestly, after listening to her account of how her Bosnia trip allegedly put her in danger, I can no longer support a person for that office who completely makes things up. The facts and the videos prove that she is
'truthfully' challenged and at best a drama queen who would knowingly fabricate an entire reality for attention. The worst part of it all is how many witnesses she had to know were going to be able to refute her version...
She is done!
Go Obama!!
"The facts and the videos prove that she is
'truthfully' challenged and at best a drama queen who would knowingly fabricate an entire reality for attention. The worst part of it all is how many witnesses she had to know were going to be able to refute her version... "
Obama had to do the same backtracking about his claims of ignorance regarding Pastor Wright.
Lucky for liberals McCain got the Republican nomination. They'll still have a liberal in the White House, but he won't be a democrat.
Obama did no such thing.
He wasn't there that day. Why don't you spend a little of your idle time asking why Nixon, nor Reagan denounced the bigot Billy Graham (their buddy) and why your boy Bush said nothing when their pal Falwell said "America asked to be attacked"..or when Pat Robertson said Sharon deserved the stroke that he had because God gave it to him?
You are proving just how blind and one way you are.
Real Americans have always seen two sides to every story.
Only fascists and dictators act as judge and jury with no accountability..Don't you have any capacity to grow as a human being??
You live in a fools world, where you even call George Bush a liberal..hey, QUICK, go check..see if there are any liberals hiding under your bed!! They're everywhere!
Either that or you're an unrealistic bitter fool who just doesn't understand politics.
College educated? I highly doubt it.
If you were, get your money back!!
You haven't made a factually worthy point here..Ever.
Mr. Bayh's conjecture deserves a negative opinion because it it pure bunk.
The fact that Hillary won the Democratic primary in a particular state has NOTHING to do with who will win that state in November's general election, and most superdelegates are smart enough to realize that. ANY democrat will win against John McCain in New York, Massachusetts, New Jersey, California and (this year) in Ohio and Pennsylvania. What matters is who can win the purple states, and in that metric, Barack has demolished Hillary.
It's the old college try because every day now, as Hillary's hopes fade, her crew invents a new set of rules which miraculously show her to be the winner despite loosing in delegates, states won and popular vote. It's REALLY hard to explain why you are more electable because you have lost the popular vote by more than 700,000!
You are greatly discounting all of those who voted for Hillary in the primaries BUT will vote for McCain in November.
Just because the obacarama blind media does not report it, it does not mean it will not happen. When we all (and believe me, there are MANY of us, will go in the voting booth in Novemeber, there is NOTHING the media frenzy can do about it. Well, unless the black panthers will storm the polling places and rule by intimidation like they did in the caucuses.
Hm, but then again, I guarantee you that the republican political machine, heck, the republicans in general, would have a VERY DIFFERENT response to this than the Clinton campaign did. So don't hold your breath, blacks are 10% and they ALL voted already. The obacarama whites, as well. The statistics simply do not hold in November. AND, you are grossly disregarding the long-lasting effect of the 'pastor-disaster' offensive rants.
More bunk, and it certaily looks like racist bunk as well. Yes, I am well aware that the KKK still is here, and votes. Fortunately in VERY small numbers.
Hillary has NO chance of capturing Republican votes in a general election. She does very poorly among Independents as well. The only Republican crossover vote she has secured came after Rush instructed his followers to vote for her in Ohio and Texas. She would not have carried either of those states in the primary except for the Rush Rebels. And there is no way she would carry them in the general election.
Most telling, why did Rush ask his listeners to vote for Hillary? Because the Republicans believe she is unelectable.
it would be nice to see the media start to take an interest in how many people who have known the Clinton's have died under mysterious circumstance. Some 47 of them including Vince Foster(top adviser to them for 25yrs.)who supposedly committed suicide and his desk had been riffled. Do you think the Clinton's have much to hide????????????
I am very tired of the media just going on & on about this preacher and all they look at is the one sentence instead of his long time career and his distinguished war record.
CNN news is so biased against Obama it makes me sick.